<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Video Mining: A Technology Whose Time Has Come</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.thevirtualcircle.com/2008/07/video-mining-a-technology-whose-time-has-come/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.thevirtualcircle.com/2008/07/video-mining-a-technology-whose-time-has-come/</link>
	<description>Just another WordPress site</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 14:32:50 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=abc</generator>
<xhtml:meta xmlns:xhtml="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" name="robots" content="noindex" />
	<item>
		<title>By: The March of the Fuzzy Emails &#124; HaveMacWillBlog (aka Robin Bloor’s Blog)</title>
		<link>http://www.thevirtualcircle.com/2008/07/video-mining-a-technology-whose-time-has-come/comment-page-1/#comment-343</link>
		<dc:creator>The March of the Fuzzy Emails &#124; HaveMacWillBlog (aka Robin Bloor’s Blog)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 12:24:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://havemacwillblog.com/?p=1058#comment-343</guid>
		<description>[...] I&#8217;ve mentioned Vidsys before and I&#8217;ve also managed to get a little excited about Video Mining (a term I coined by rubbing no more than two neurones together). There&#8217;s a trend in motion [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I&#8217;ve mentioned Vidsys before and I&#8217;ve also managed to get a little excited about Video Mining (a term I coined by rubbing no more than two neurones together). There&#8217;s a trend in motion [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: peter</title>
		<link>http://www.thevirtualcircle.com/2008/07/video-mining-a-technology-whose-time-has-come/comment-page-1/#comment-340</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 15:57:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://havemacwillblog.com/?p=1058#comment-340</guid>
		<description>sorry for the &quot;stake in surveillance systems&quot;. i was misinterpreting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sorry for the &#8220;stake in surveillance systems&#8221;. i was misinterpreting.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Admin</title>
		<link>http://www.thevirtualcircle.com/2008/07/video-mining-a-technology-whose-time-has-come/comment-page-1/#comment-342</link>
		<dc:creator>Admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 14:23:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://havemacwillblog.com/?p=1058#comment-342</guid>
		<description>You seem to tie yourself in knots. Suddenly lighting is a deterrent to intruders but cameras are not. In terms of defensible space there are a whole series of things that act as a deterrent to intruders which include; lighting, locks, planting bushes under ground floor windows, having a clearly identified boundary to a property (psychologically defensible space), having a visible (real or fake) burglar alarms on the side of the building, having a dog and of course cameras. All of these have &quot;effects&quot; as you say. The primary effect is to deter.
As for crime itself, the most effective deterrent known is fear of being caught. Cameras heighten that fear in some would be criminals. This is why cameras that are turned off can deter (when first introduced some speed cameras in the UK had no film in them, but still deterred speeding). This is also why most bank robbers now wear masks.
Naturally crime moves to places where surveillance is less. This is hardly new information. &quot;When the cat&#039;s away the mice will play&quot; has been popular wisdom for centuries.
The idea that CCTV may be badly deployed at times seems credible to me. That would be poor use of good technology. In the UK there may indeed be an over-investment in such systems in terms of cost/benefit.
The statement that &quot;the widespread CCTV systems have done nothing to enhance security on the streets or even solve most crimes that happen.&quot; is worth a little dissection:
&quot;solve most crimes that happen&quot; logically means that they do solve some crimes that happen. (Last time I was in the UK I saw footage of a murder in a shopping center where the murderer was clearly identifiable and identified by the CCTV footage)
&quot;nothing to enhance security on the streets&quot; seems quite likely, if crime tends to move elsewhere - to places of lower surveillance. The cameras move the crime around.
You talk about misuse and complain that the people behind the monitors are not subject to surveillance. Isn&#039;t it a little bizarre to make such a statement while you&#039;re claiming that surveillance is ineffective.
The fact that vendors of anything will propagate propaganda is not new information. It&#039;s being happening since Adam was a boy.
You think I have a &quot;stake in surveillance systems&quot;. I don&#039;t. I just write about things and so I wrote about this. But why accuse me of it? Ad hominem comments tend to discredit the writer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You seem to tie yourself in knots. Suddenly lighting is a deterrent to intruders but cameras are not. In terms of defensible space there are a whole series of things that act as a deterrent to intruders which include; lighting, locks, planting bushes under ground floor windows, having a clearly identified boundary to a property (psychologically defensible space), having a visible (real or fake) burglar alarms on the side of the building, having a dog and of course cameras. All of these have &#8220;effects&#8221; as you say. The primary effect is to deter.<br />
As for crime itself, the most effective deterrent known is fear of being caught. Cameras heighten that fear in some would be criminals. This is why cameras that are turned off can deter (when first introduced some speed cameras in the UK had no film in them, but still deterred speeding). This is also why most bank robbers now wear masks.<br />
Naturally crime moves to places where surveillance is less. This is hardly new information. &#8220;When the cat&#8217;s away the mice will play&#8221; has been popular wisdom for centuries.<br />
The idea that CCTV may be badly deployed at times seems credible to me. That would be poor use of good technology. In the UK there may indeed be an over-investment in such systems in terms of cost/benefit.<br />
The statement that &#8220;the widespread CCTV systems have done nothing to enhance security on the streets or even solve most crimes that happen.&#8221; is worth a little dissection:<br />
&#8220;solve most crimes that happen&#8221; logically means that they do solve some crimes that happen. (Last time I was in the UK I saw footage of a murder in a shopping center where the murderer was clearly identifiable and identified by the CCTV footage)<br />
&#8220;nothing to enhance security on the streets&#8221; seems quite likely, if crime tends to move elsewhere &#8211; to places of lower surveillance. The cameras move the crime around.<br />
You talk about misuse and complain that the people behind the monitors are not subject to surveillance. Isn&#8217;t it a little bizarre to make such a statement while you&#8217;re claiming that surveillance is ineffective.<br />
The fact that vendors of anything will propagate propaganda is not new information. It&#8217;s being happening since Adam was a boy.<br />
You think I have a &#8220;stake in surveillance systems&#8221;. I don&#8217;t. I just write about things and so I wrote about this. But why accuse me of it? Ad hominem comments tend to discredit the writer.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: peter</title>
		<link>http://www.thevirtualcircle.com/2008/07/video-mining-a-technology-whose-time-has-come/comment-page-1/#comment-338</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 08:18:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://havemacwillblog.com/?p=1058#comment-338</guid>
		<description>obviously, we both won&#039;t budge much. so i&#039;m not sure what the value of a longish discussion would be. also, please understand that, as english is not my native language, some of my arguments may be stated weakly or even offensive, when i try to be as neutral as possible.

so, just a few short remarks:

- the research results regarding surveillance consistently show that there is little predictable result of surveillance. of course, surveillance introduceses changes and has effects. but to say that &quot;The presence of cameras acts as a deterrent to would be intruders&quot; is not only overly simplified, it&#039;s also not backed up by any study i about surveillance i have seen, at least not as an effect that can be contributed to the cameras. for example, the meta-study i references (&quot;systematic review&quot; from 2002) comes to the conclusion that in those cases few where cameras were effective (mostly car parks) the effects could well be attributed to the enhanced illumination of the area necessary for the cameras. i maintain: cameras are not &quot;effective&quot; in the sense of successful or sustainable, they merely have effects.

- as regarding to speeding with cars, this is certainly a very specific situation, differing starkly from all other forms of surveillance. still, there was an example in austria where there was a &quot;section control&quot; installed at a highway where cars are measured not for momentary speed but for the average speed between two measuring point. the result was that after 9 or so month, the number of accidents involving speeding were up at the same level as before. tickets issued for speeding of course were not. people just learned to get around the surveillance. the same goes for many cases of surveillance. one of the results most scientific studies about CCTV in the UK came up with was that thiefes typically adapted.

- as for the abuse, i was clearly too provoking, and at the same time unspecific in my argument. one thing that goes for most surveillance systems is that the people behind the monitors are not subject to surveillance. as a consequence, they can use pretty much all means available to them to make recordings of the video from the surveillance cameras. often this can be done via equipment that is present, in other cases recorders are brought in and connceted to the system. most the material shown in tv shows of the &quot;americas dumbest burglars&quot; or americas dumbest pedestrians&quot; kind (or whatever they are called) is taken from surveillance systems without autorization. this constitutes one more or less systematic mis-use.

the other mis-use comes from the fact that most surveillance systems are operated privately. as such, these companies are under pressure to show their value by creating as many &quot;incidents&quot; that can be resolved as possible. therefore, typically things that most people don&#039;t care about (and some do, but not enough to really do something about it) such as peeing in a park or between cars, throwing away litter and other kinds of &quot;social crime&quot; are suddenly brought to our (and the police&#039;s) attention because of this conflict of interest we have here. i would call this anther form of mis-use.

also, this shows that of course such systems can be very effective, but in most cases, not in the way intended. as numerous studies in the uk show, the widespread CCTV systems have done nothing to enhance security on the streets or even solve most crimes that happen. what they have done is chance the environment we live in in a very subtle and, for many, aggravating way.

ok, even though i planned to write only a few short remarks, this has become somewhat lenghtish. given that you obviously have a stake in such systems, i still believe that we both won&#039;t budge much. otoh, i am very curious about how the discussion will evolve (if it does).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>obviously, we both won&#8217;t budge much. so i&#8217;m not sure what the value of a longish discussion would be. also, please understand that, as english is not my native language, some of my arguments may be stated weakly or even offensive, when i try to be as neutral as possible.</p>
<p>so, just a few short remarks:</p>
<p>- the research results regarding surveillance consistently show that there is little predictable result of surveillance. of course, surveillance introduceses changes and has effects. but to say that &#8220;The presence of cameras acts as a deterrent to would be intruders&#8221; is not only overly simplified, it&#8217;s also not backed up by any study i about surveillance i have seen, at least not as an effect that can be contributed to the cameras. for example, the meta-study i references (&#8220;systematic review&#8221; from 2002) comes to the conclusion that in those cases few where cameras were effective (mostly car parks) the effects could well be attributed to the enhanced illumination of the area necessary for the cameras. i maintain: cameras are not &#8220;effective&#8221; in the sense of successful or sustainable, they merely have effects.</p>
<p>- as regarding to speeding with cars, this is certainly a very specific situation, differing starkly from all other forms of surveillance. still, there was an example in austria where there was a &#8220;section control&#8221; installed at a highway where cars are measured not for momentary speed but for the average speed between two measuring point. the result was that after 9 or so month, the number of accidents involving speeding were up at the same level as before. tickets issued for speeding of course were not. people just learned to get around the surveillance. the same goes for many cases of surveillance. one of the results most scientific studies about CCTV in the UK came up with was that thiefes typically adapted.</p>
<p>- as for the abuse, i was clearly too provoking, and at the same time unspecific in my argument. one thing that goes for most surveillance systems is that the people behind the monitors are not subject to surveillance. as a consequence, they can use pretty much all means available to them to make recordings of the video from the surveillance cameras. often this can be done via equipment that is present, in other cases recorders are brought in and connceted to the system. most the material shown in tv shows of the &#8220;americas dumbest burglars&#8221; or americas dumbest pedestrians&#8221; kind (or whatever they are called) is taken from surveillance systems without autorization. this constitutes one more or less systematic mis-use.</p>
<p>the other mis-use comes from the fact that most surveillance systems are operated privately. as such, these companies are under pressure to show their value by creating as many &#8220;incidents&#8221; that can be resolved as possible. therefore, typically things that most people don&#8217;t care about (and some do, but not enough to really do something about it) such as peeing in a park or between cars, throwing away litter and other kinds of &#8220;social crime&#8221; are suddenly brought to our (and the police&#8217;s) attention because of this conflict of interest we have here. i would call this anther form of mis-use.</p>
<p>also, this shows that of course such systems can be very effective, but in most cases, not in the way intended. as numerous studies in the uk show, the widespread CCTV systems have done nothing to enhance security on the streets or even solve most crimes that happen. what they have done is chance the environment we live in in a very subtle and, for many, aggravating way.</p>
<p>ok, even though i planned to write only a few short remarks, this has become somewhat lenghtish. given that you obviously have a stake in such systems, i still believe that we both won&#8217;t budge much. otoh, i am very curious about how the discussion will evolve (if it does).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Admin</title>
		<link>http://www.thevirtualcircle.com/2008/07/video-mining-a-technology-whose-time-has-come/comment-page-1/#comment-339</link>
		<dc:creator>Admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 13:29:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://havemacwillblog.com/?p=1058#comment-339</guid>
		<description>Let&#039;s take this piece by piece.
(a) video surveillance does generally not act as a deterrent;
Your link http://www.notbored.org/cameras-not-effective.html contradicts this directly by maintaining that cameras only deter some people. The suggestion is quite absurd of course, for an obvious counter-example cameras deter speeding highly effectively.

(b) the records are useless if you want to solve the crime;
This is another clearly incorrect assertion that only requires a single counter example to refute. Aside from speed cameras we have the impact that the cameras around London (put there to identify IRA car bombs) had on car thieves. The cameras recognized license numbers and checked them against cars reported as stolen. Car thieves soon learned not to drive into London. (Would that be deterrence by the way?) There is also the thousands of examples of robbers robbing banks and/or shops and getting &quot;caught on camera&quot;. Caught on camera is even a cliché, and you maintain it doesn&#039;t happen?

(c) the recordings are subject to regular abuse by the persons watching
I have no axe to grind here, but this generalization also seems to be a huge stretch to me. Most surveillance systems simply are not linked to video editing suites, so I&#039;m not sure what abuse you&#039;re talking about. In any event I have no axe to grind here. The simple fact is that camera surveillance is a tool and it can be abused - just like a hammer. Regular abuse seems like a huge stretch to me.

Finally..
I find arguments of this kind deeply worrying. There is undoubtedly a Big Brother tendency in the UK and the US that needs to be opposed. Those who argue that cameras are ineffective when they obviously are not, are doing a terrible disservice to civil liberties.
Personally I oppose the general surveillance of citizens because it is indeed effective, not because it is ineffective.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s take this piece by piece.<br />
(a) video surveillance does generally not act as a deterrent;<br />
Your link <a href="http://www.notbored.org/cameras-not-effective.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.notbored.org/cameras-not-effective.html</a> contradicts this directly by maintaining that cameras only deter some people. The suggestion is quite absurd of course, for an obvious counter-example cameras deter speeding highly effectively.</p>
<p>(b) the records are useless if you want to solve the crime;<br />
This is another clearly incorrect assertion that only requires a single counter example to refute. Aside from speed cameras we have the impact that the cameras around London (put there to identify IRA car bombs) had on car thieves. The cameras recognized license numbers and checked them against cars reported as stolen. Car thieves soon learned not to drive into London. (Would that be deterrence by the way?) There is also the thousands of examples of robbers robbing banks and/or shops and getting &#8220;caught on camera&#8221;. Caught on camera is even a cliché, and you maintain it doesn&#8217;t happen?</p>
<p>(c) the recordings are subject to regular abuse by the persons watching<br />
I have no axe to grind here, but this generalization also seems to be a huge stretch to me. Most surveillance systems simply are not linked to video editing suites, so I&#8217;m not sure what abuse you&#8217;re talking about. In any event I have no axe to grind here. The simple fact is that camera surveillance is a tool and it can be abused &#8211; just like a hammer. Regular abuse seems like a huge stretch to me.</p>
<p>Finally..<br />
I find arguments of this kind deeply worrying. There is undoubtedly a Big Brother tendency in the UK and the US that needs to be opposed. Those who argue that cameras are ineffective when they obviously are not, are doing a terrible disservice to civil liberties.<br />
Personally I oppose the general surveillance of citizens because it is indeed effective, not because it is ineffective.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: peter</title>
		<link>http://www.thevirtualcircle.com/2008/07/video-mining-a-technology-whose-time-has-come/comment-page-1/#comment-341</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 07:15:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://havemacwillblog.com/?p=1058#comment-341</guid>
		<description>your &quot;truth about video security systems&quot; is simply wrong. long-term studies have shown that

(a) video surveillance does generally not act as a deterrent;
(b) the records are useless if you want to solve the crime;
(c) the recordings are subject to regular abuse by the persons watching.

all this can be read from the various studies that have been conducted on the massive use of CCTV in england; also, other studies have shown the same results. there might be local variations and exceptions in isolated use, but in general, your &quot;truth&quot; are not.

let me give you a couple of scientific ressources to show that i didn&#039;t just invent that for some reason:

Welsh &amp; Farrington: Crime prevention e?ects of closed circuit television: a systematic review, 2002

Sir Simon Davies, Enquiry into digital images as evidence, 1997

one good article about the uselessness in solving crimes:

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23412867-details/Tens+of+thousands+of+CCTV+cameras%2C+yet+80%25+of+crime+unsolved/article.do

and an overview of &quot;doesn&#039;t work&quot;-articles:

http://www.notbored.org/cameras-not-effective.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>your &#8220;truth about video security systems&#8221; is simply wrong. long-term studies have shown that</p>
<p>(a) video surveillance does generally not act as a deterrent;<br />
(b) the records are useless if you want to solve the crime;<br />
(c) the recordings are subject to regular abuse by the persons watching.</p>
<p>all this can be read from the various studies that have been conducted on the massive use of CCTV in england; also, other studies have shown the same results. there might be local variations and exceptions in isolated use, but in general, your &#8220;truth&#8221; are not.</p>
<p>let me give you a couple of scientific ressources to show that i didn&#8217;t just invent that for some reason:</p>
<p>Welsh &amp; Farrington: Crime prevention e?ects of closed circuit television: a systematic review, 2002</p>
<p>Sir Simon Davies, Enquiry into digital images as evidence, 1997</p>
<p>one good article about the uselessness in solving crimes:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23412867-details/Tens+of+thousands+of+CCTV+cameras%2C+yet+80%25+of+crime+unsolved/article.do" rel="nofollow">http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23412867-details/Tens+of+thousands+of+CCTV+cameras%2C+yet+80%25+of+crime+unsolved/article.do</a></p>
<p>and an overview of &#8220;doesn&#8217;t work&#8221;-articles:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.notbored.org/cameras-not-effective.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.notbored.org/cameras-not-effective.html</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
